Brees – Career INT% – 2.7 meaning he throws INT on 2.7% of ATT
Manning – Career INT% – 3.2.

Most importantly – what phenomenal Wide Recieving Talent has Brees had? Colston is very good but can rarely get through a whole season. Will other teams clamor for Lance Moore? Devery Henderson? Jimmy Graham is at worst the 3rd best TE and he’s only had him for 2 seasons.

To go to your argument about Tom Brady and the rest having 4 INT games. You are correct. Everybody has those games. Nothing goes right and the D just has your number. Here’s where, using a little stat invented by Steve Caronia called AWtFGP, I know Eli isn’t elite. When Payton, Rodgers, Brees or Brady throw 4 INT’s the reaction is “Holy cow, what happened?” When Eli throws 4 INT’s the reaction is always “Yeah, well that’s Eli.” Sports writers never talk about “Which Tom Brady is going to show up today, the good or the Bad?”, But they do say that about Eli.

On top of that, the sniff test. If you have to debate whether or not he’s Elite, he’s not. No one debates the other 4. Especially when the argument could be made that ELi is not even the best QB to come out of his draft.

Personally, I think Eli is, right now, at the top of that 2nd tier. Which is a pretty good place to be.

I’m going to respond to your post in parts:

“That being said, I think Eli Manning is a GREAT quarterback. He’ll be in the HOF. I’m not sure what team this writer is affiliated with, but to not call Eli elite is an outdated argument that only Cowboys, Jets, New England and Chargers fans, and maybe jealous ex-Giants QB’s, have the insecure stubbornness to engage in.”
Me too. But great isn’t elite. He probably will be in the hall of fame. Joe Namath is in the Hall of Fame too, and he’s the most overrated QB of all time. And I am a Jets fan, just so you know. But just like you are not a Giant fan and think ELi is elite, me being a Jet fan has zero to do with my assessment of Eli. I think Tom Brady and Dan Marino are two of the top ten QBs of all time. Think I might have some negative feelings about them? In addition, I have numerous friends who are Giants fans who completely agree with me.

“This is no longer a topic of debate for most football fans.”
That is just categorically false. When he had his most recent meltdown LAST YEAR, the concept of him being elite was brought up over and over again. I promise you, it will happen again this coming year.

“while it is true that SB’s are a team accomplishment, this writer ignores the fact that Eli has mentored and led two different teams to the SB.”
I think I pretty clearly stated that his 2 Super Bowl MVPs are a huge positive and puts him in very select company. The main crux of the article is merely that that fact alone does not make him an elite QB and a peer of the top 3 or 4 in the game.

“If Eli personifies the up and down Giants, as you say, then an examination of the TEAM is required.”
I agree. My whole point is that Eli’s inconsistencies were coupled with a great running game and superb defensive performances at times. At other times, Eli was a monster and performing at a very high level in years in which the Giants team was not as successful. Eli is not always the straw that stirs the drink.

“Eli has brought along and made stars of his receivers and tight ends. NFL players know that if they can play for Eli, and do well, they will get paid. They leave and then are never heard from again.”
I literally can’t think of a single person who this occurred with. The only person I can think of as even remotely possible is Steve Smith, but he was injured and the 17th option for the Eagles last year, so he gets an incomplete. I also can’t think of a single big name receiver who has signed with the Giants to play with Eli.

“Eli also does not give a damn about his own personal stats even though he is already smashing every Giants passing record (how is this done if you are inconsistent?”
This is done when you play in an era of football that is completely pass happy. Every QB is shattering records of every kind all over the place. If Phil Simms played in today’s league, you don’t think he’d be getting 4,000 yards every year?

“He does not make garbage time tds of which Rodgers, Brady, and Brees feed off. I mean, Tom Brady’s 6 tds against Tim Tebow is impressive how?”
I totally agree that there are some inflated number with some QBs (especially Brady; New England loves to run up the score). My counter argument is this: how do you think these games became blowouts in the first place? It’s because of the terrifying offenses that these QBs run. Their stellar play leads to the creation of garbage time. It doesn’t discount what they have done.

“If performing at an exceptionally high level week in and week out is your definition of elite, then I’m surprised that ANY QB is elite. Brady has thrown 4 ints in games, Brees has been an abominable int machine, Rodgers has choked up games with as much flair as Romo, and yes, Eli is not perfect. Lets not even get into Peyton’s horrible decisions. There’s is NOT ONE QB who is exceptional week in and week out. That is a flat out illusion.”
I specifically pointed this out in the article. I said that all QBS have their ups and downs, never said they are infallible. But none of those QBs have anything even remotely resembling the poor stretches that Eli has had. It’s not even close.

“There is not one football fan that doesnt know exactly what you mean when you say, “Tyree” or “Manningham” or “18 and 1″. THIS, too, is what football is about.”
I certainly agree that Eli has had amazing moments. So is David Tyree elite? Is Manningham elite? What about Trent Dilfer’s awesome pass to Brandon Stokely? Does that instantly make either of them elite? 18-1 is owed to the Giants defensive line way more than Eli Manning. Again, if Asante Samuel catches that interception, THAT’S the moment all football fans will know. You can’t pull a few select plays out of a career and allow that to define a player on the whole.

Just let me close by saying that I think Eli is really good. He’s certainly top ten in the league right now. But that doesn’t mean he’s “elite” to me. There are a handful of quarterbacks who have performed exceptionally better than Eli in far greater stretches. He’s a tier below the top guys. And, as I said in the article, the fact that he is going to be in the Hall of Fame will makes this discussion even more interesting.

Thanks again for taking the time to read and respond, and please know that we love the debate.

I’m not sure what team this writer is affiliated with, but to not call Eli elite is an outdated argument that only Cowboys, Jets, New England and Chargers fans, and maybe jealous ex-Giants QB’s, have the insecure stubbornness to engage in. This is no longer a topic of debate for most football fans. Having said that, while it is true that SB’s are a team accomplishment, this writer ignores the fact that Eli has mentored and led two different teams to the SB. He was had rookies on the field and nary a ProBowler on the roster. One or two at most. Whereas, Romo, for example, in 2007, had what, 12 or 13? That team also swept the Giants in the regular season.

If Eli personifies the up and down Giants, as you say, then an examination of the TEAM is required. Eli has brought along and made stars of his receivers and tight ends. NFL players know that if they can play for Eli, and do well, they will get paid. They leave and then are never heard from again. Eli also does not give a damn about his own personal stats even though he is already smashing every Giants passing record (how is this done if you are inconsistent?). He will not take a sack. He will come out of a game in a blow out. He does not make garbage time tds of which Rodgers, Brady, and Brees feed off. I mean, Tom Brady’s 6 tds against Tim Tebow is impressive how?

If performing at an exceptionally high level week in and week out is your definition of elite, then I’m surprised that ANY QB is elite. Brady has thrown 4 ints in games, Brees has been an abominable int machine, Rodgers has choked up games with as much flair as Romo, and yes, Eli is not perfect. Lets not even get into Peyton’s horrible decisions. There’s is NOT ONE QB who is exceptional week in and week out. That is a flat out illusion.

While I understand that Eli Manning is a frustrating performer, for some, there is none from the top elite tier that has had the number of iconic NFL plays that Eli already has. There is not one football fan that doesnt know exactly what you mean when you say, “Tyree” or “Manningham” or “18 and 1″. THIS, too, is what football is about. Not whether or not said QB helped you win your fantasy pool.

I can argue that Brees is nothing special in this top tier. Rodgers still has more to prove. Brady and Peyton are the iconic players. And Eli Manning is absolutely elite. The guy invented a whole new NFL classification. He’s a unique player and a 2x SBMVP, only one in five that can make that ELITE distinction.